Teapartiers, thank Glenn Beck for the roadmap to destroy the movement

Posted by Jason | Posted in Video | Posted on 21-02-2010

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Now that Glenn Beck used the 9/11 Truther question to attempt to discredit Debra Medina, it appears he has handed the left the perfect stick to beat the teapartiers over the head with.

Luckily, teapartiers are not Jason Mattera‘s Obama Zombies. They have people like Sheriff Mack, who know what and why they believe what they believe, so they don’t fall for idiots like Chris Matthews.

Another find from the Daily Paul.

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Comments (8)

I despise Chris Matthews – he claims that OSHA is there to keep workplaces safe. What Mack should have said is that OSHA isn’t about safety, it’s about control. If a workplace wasn’t safe, NO ONE WOULD WORK THERE. You don’t need a governing body to force businesses to be safe, they’ll do that on their own because they want to attract workers.

The whole succession thing at the end – He was so quick to dismiss it, but I’d like Matthews to point out in the Constitution where it prohibits states from succeeding from the union if they so choose.

And again with the whole 9/11 Truther thing. People who question our gov about 9/11 are no different than those who questioned how much FDR knew about the bombings on Pearl Harbor. I bet both administrations had pieces of information, but not enough to do anything about it. To that end, I suppose they bear some level of responsibility, but I don’t see either gov having all the information and choosing to do nothing about it. That’s just not logical.

All that said, it’s pointless at this stage to even be looking back nearly 10 years at 1 day just to assign blame. We should be looking forward and seeing how we’re going to prevent the next 9/11.

Based on your Post Title, I’m assuming you feel those who want to discredit the Tea Party movement will just call them a bunch of truthers? I suppose the MSM could try to keep hammering that point home to discredit them, but I’d debate how much effect that will actually have. I don’t think Beck did much damage to Medina’s numbers.

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Well John, you have a very narrow view of employment. I have seen people killed in unsafe construction sites, factories with little or no safety features and more. Prospective employees would line up for the jobs left vacant the very next day!

People will continue to work there as long as they feel they have no choice. For too many people, that feeling is there all the time.

Business is all about profit, and until work conditions impact profit, too many will ignore everything they can unless forced to change their ways.

As for all the “debate” about truth – it is really amazing to see how little fact and how much emotion plays here.

As for preventing the next 9/11 – good luck. A sufficiently motivated enemy, willing to die for their cause can always wreck havoc. It’s only takes one. We can do all that a reasonable people can do, but we can’t stop them all.

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Your statement about work conditions is only valid in the system we have now. In a true free market, people would not be locked into any given job and would not feel like they have to stay there. If conditions were continuing to be abusive or employees were treated as cogs, then that’s where a union would be an effective way to convince the employer to take the necessary steps to ensure the safety of the employees.

You’re right about 9/11, it’s unlikely we’ll stop all the attacks… some will leak through, however as long as we continue to meddle in the affairs of other countries, we will continue to upset people to the point they want to strike back. An easy way to prevent the next 9/11 is to not give anyone a reason to want to attack us. We don’t have to get along with every country, but we certainly don’t have to go looking for trouble like we do.

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John, good points. People think because you are free market you are against unions. This is not the case. Unions are perfectly fine in the free market as far as I am concerned. The problem with unions now is they use the government to force their agendas down the free markets throat.

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Eric,

People are killed in “safe” construction sites as well. Don’t set up some perfect world, and expect the free market to meet it, when the regulated, government mandated world doesn’t meet it either. People can choose for themselves if they want to work somewhere unsafe. Have you ever thought of the people who can’t work because the government drove up the cost of each employee so much that they cut back employees?

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YOU SAID: “OSHA isn’t about safety, it’s about control. If a workplace wasn’t safe, NO ONE WOULD WORK THERE. You don’t need a governing body to force businesses to be safe.”

Oh really? So we should just develop an honor system and hope that company owners and executives will provide a safe work environment for thier employess without any oversight whatsoever. Secondly, many people would absolutely work in an unsafe or non-compliant workplace as long as the paychecks keep rolling in, particularly when the job market is lean. It’s times just like these where business owners will make up lost revenue by putting off scheduled maintance of machinery, fire supression systems, safety training, turning a blind eye to ISO standards.

You said we don’t need a governing body to “force” business to be safe. That is not the purpose of OSHA and more importantly, they shouldn’t have to force compliance, but rather inforce compliance. Osha sets the standard and it’s up to the business owner to operate within the standard. The only time a business is forced to comply is when they’ve been caught operating in violation of health and safety standards.

I’m on my 10th year in County Code Enforcment and you’d be amazed at the level of danger “some” business owners will allow thier employess to operate in. I’m not talking about ear plugs and eye protection or even uncertified forklift operators, but 5 ton stamping presses with safty guards and fail-safe switches not working or removed entirely.

I don’t claim to know what the Tea Party movement is all about, but on the surface, it seems extreamly anti-government. I’m all for not being told by the government how many guns I can own, or that my kids have to be taught about sex, morality and other issues at school that really belong at home between children, adolescents and thier parents. But there can never come a day when Government is removed from every aspect of society.

Just what you said in your post is a fine example of what I’m talking about. From my perspective, the Tea Party has a romantic urning for a return to simpiler times back when the constitution was drafted. It’s always about or founding fathers and the principils they lived by back then. While that is a tender notion, it’s not practical. Or founding fathers new nothing about an industrialized nation or a global economy for that matter. There is reason why the hands on a clock travel in only one direction. Time travels forward and there simply is no going back.

We are an ever changing society and I could tell you without any doubt that if you could bring back our founding fathers from 1776 to 2010, the would be curled up in the fetal position on the ground from the noise, cars, jet aircraft, not to mention that America now consist of 300,000,000 people of every color, creed, and religions they’ve never heard of.

Not to be rude or insensitive, but it seems to me that the tea partiers are not afraid of the future, but rather of an overwhelming sense that they are being left behind. Our county has stood strong for over 250 years through bloody revolution, civil war, famine, drought. We’ve walked the razors edge towards full sacle nuclear war, and have now experienced bloody terrorism. If George Bush couldn’t kill it, there’s now way some skinny black dude from Chicago gonns kill it either. If our founding fathers have given us anything that has endured the test of time, it’s our systems of checks and balances.

In peace time or at war, we are and will always be the greatest country on the planet. We are the land of the free and the home of the brave, not the home of I’m afraid. That seems to be the endless narrative coming from the tea party movement.

They say “Oh we can’t try terrorist in New York, it will make us a target, Obama is making the country unsafe, we have to protect ever square inch of our boardes. For a group of people who invoke religion and tout their christianity every chance they get, I have never seen a group of people so frightened of death.

There are 300 million of us. Why do you think these terrorist pussies get in air planes and fly them into building, or blow up American embassys on the other side of the globe. Do you think they have the balls to put on a uniform, pick up a rifel and march in formation down mainstreet USA like our soldiers do down the God Damn streets of Bhagdad? – No they don’t! – You won’t see a wave of muslim terrorist invading the shores of our east and west coast.

They know better! – They’d never make it off the fucking sand along the California coast or even to the boardwalk at Coney Island on the east coast. And it won’t be or military alone that they have to worry about. In this country, we have the right to bear arms and guess what Bubba? – I’m armed to the fucking teeth and I’m not the only one and they know it. With our military spread out all over the world and in two wars in the middle east and they still don’t come to us in the numbers that we go to them…

Sadly, we are caught up in our racial, religios, and economic differances that it would take something like that to cure us of what has been ailing us for decades in the country. I’m telling you if that day ever came where it was us against them right here in our own front yard with our freedom and liberty really hanging in the balance, all of that bullshit would disappear in a second. It won’t matter if you’re black, white, asian, gay, straight, blind, crippled, or fucking crazy! – All that will matter is “are you an American” and if so come on then! – Lock & Load.

That’s why it drives me nuts when I hear people saying that Obama wants to abolish the 2nd ammendment and confiscate everyones guns. Sooner or later, we’re going to have to stop all of this anti-government nonsense. We can onlt do that by forging ahead as a county, as a society no matter how frightening or uncertian it may seem. There is no going back! – Not now, not ever.

That’s my two cents.

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I’m not saying all business will enact safe workplace policies, but the market would sort that out. There are at least a couple incentives for employers to keep the workplace safe – Workers Compensation Insurance, and qualified labor. Even if the labor pool for qualified employees doesn’t keep them honest, an audit by their Insurance Company will. If they have a lot of losses also, then they’re going to get nailed in their premium. Word will get out quickly that they don’t have a safe workplace, which will discourage workers from applying, or they’ll have to pay more for those employees. That directly impacts their bottom line, which is a big incentive to provide safe environment (I know it does where I work).

Here’s the deal with the Tea Party (at least what I and those I know in the party represent) – It’s a return to honoring and protecting the Constitution. Everyone understands time moves in one direction, however we haven’t had a Congress or a Presidential administration in over 100 years that has upheld its oath to honor and uphold the Constitution. If the Constitution does not explicitly provide you the power to do something, then you don’t have the power to do it. That means Social Security, Medicare, OSHA, and all the other government programs are unconstitutional. Those are all things that, if desired, should be enacted at the State level.

The beauty of enacting any of those fed programs at the state level first is that the states are free to experiment with many different ideas and programs. Competition breeds the best results and the most successful ideas will be enacted by all the states.

The federal government’s sole purpose is to protect our freedoms and our country from attacks. That means we need courts and police, and a large enough military to defend our borders. What we don’t need is probably close to 1000 military bases around the globe. Don’t you think that is partly responsible as to why we’re the target of attack?

The problem with our checks and balances is that they’re being excoriated. Many presidents have written Executive Orders which run end-around Congress. Some are repealed later (see the ones JFK wrote during the Cuban Missle Crisis, repealed by Nixon), and others are expanded upon (see the order Reagan wrote RE: Interpol and expanded upon by Obama).

I also share your belief that even with everything that’s going on in this country, we are still the greatest on earth. Unfortunately that won’t continue if we can’t get our fiscal house in order. The more we owe our creditors, the more influence they will have over us.

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Chris, tell us what you really think!

Thanks for the long comment. I won’t be able to tackle it all, because I only have my lunch time to do it (plus eat). You talk about the honor system, but it’s not an honor system. It’s a voluntary system where both parties agree on how they will interact with each other. Government is the least honorable system. Also, how are you seeing all these horrible work conditions? I thought the government took care of that for us? Have you ever considered many businesses skimp because of the cost of government that is piled on them? Also, have you ever thought about the people who have to live off the government when they’d prefer to work because jobs have been chased out of the country?

While you see the tea party as anti-gov’t, I see it as pro-freedom. Freedom isn’t something that you just give away because the world has changed since our founders were alive. That is just silly. Freedom is eternal is the only just way for societies to exist. Those who take away are freedoms love guys like you who think the world is so complex that we can’t be free anymore.

Also, the global economy is as old as civilization. Just because communications is faster doesn’t mean the founders didn’t trade. The civil war was fought partly over international trade. The North loved tariffs, but it harmed the South. Of course, that didn’t matter because the guys with all the money in the north used the government to their advantage.

While I agree the US is the best country on earth, you are naive to think it will always be that way. Ever heard of Rome? I’m sure they all sat around till the last brick fell talking about how great they were and are.

Lastly, you are right. You don’t know what the teaparty is. The teaparty isn’t the party of the war. They are a group of people against the growth of government, the deficits, and bringing back the constitution. You are thinking of the neocons when it comes to war, and most of the teaparty is not for war.

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